Dying for me?

soldier.PNG

A very good quote from Franc Tremblay:

No “messiah” has ever “died for me.” They died because they were fools.
No soldier has ever “died for me.” He died for his beliefs and his paycheck.

I have never asked anyone to die for me, and I don’t care if you think you sacrificed yourself for me. You haven’t. I never chose for anyone to do this, I never paid anyone, I never agreed to any such thing. YOU did it for yourself and now you are putting this on our shoulders? Go fuck yourself, you arrogant prick.

Die veteran, die soldier. You deserve death. HE WHO LIVES BY THE SWORD DIES BY THE SWORD. EVEN YOUR RELIGION SAYS SO.

Right on!

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22 comments so far

  1. staticbrain.com on

    I never asked any soldier to die for me, either.

  2. Aaron Kinney on

    Damn! Franc does not mince words.

  3. fomer soldier on

    we are all being lied to there is no war today worth
    dying in or killing in. not even peacekeeping missions. today it is all about money and covering for our leaders fuckups. sad but true. it is never ok to end a life no matter how good they pay or how much propaganda they push on you.

    We are all responseble and we are all a part of the solution.

  4. Concern on

    No, indeed you never asked. They took it upon themselves to go out and protect you. Granted, the war on currently is wrong, a Bush family event basically, but the soldiers out there today never asked to get thrown out there. They followed orders, as any good soldier should.

    As far as I’m concerned, anyone who decides to try and bash soldier, to tell them to die, is a person who seriously needs a little trip over into Somalia, Darfur, and Iran. That’s what they fight to protect us from, thats their job.

    When he says the usual ignorant blather about religion, he only proves his own stupidity. Not every soldier is Christian, not every American is Christian, and although it is indeed the majority, it is by no means the norm. In essence, this Franc Tremblay person is a simple ‘cry for attention’ leftist who will simply flock to whichever side benefits himself and grabs the most attention from like-minded radicals.

  5. Jonny Lindsay (RN) on

    I completely disagree with you. I’m a sailor in the Royal Navy but I’m not the normal type, I’m used in a direct contact role in something called AWFP.
    Life story aside – whilst i’m not American, I think your country is the same as mine. There is very little respect for the soldiers, sailors and airmen who serve your country as there is in mine. I have had insults shouted and evening objects thrown at me when i wear my uniform off-base and that is ridiculous.
    Whilst you did not ask the servicemen and I to fight for you, you did choose to belong to your country and we chose to fight for my country. We have no choice what war we are involved in, we merely do our duty and that is all that can be asked of us and is all that we can give.
    We don’t choose to sacrifice oursleves, we don’t tend to like being killed but when we do people should at least respect those that have died in the service of their country and stop destroying their honour.

    There will never be any politics on a battlefield, there will however always be soliders and those soldiers at the very least deserve respect.

  6. kody on

    yeah im an artillery gunner in the canadian forces with the 42nd feild regiment and i gotta say this guy has no fucking need at all to say that shit if he likes his freedom he should be fucking proud of what us soldiers do atleast we do something for the country we dont just mauk it as far as im concerned he is the arrogant prick in this all

    i love being a soldier and i have respect for my fellow british american and canadian troops stand strong

  7. Brad Reddekopp on

    Whee! The patriotic propaganda dupes are here.

  8. SGT Dean on

    Franc you’re a half-wit who’s half-right. They never died for you. They died for something much better than you. However, in the process you’ve been enjoying the fruits of their sacrifices so it may be appropriate of you to show some respect.

  9. Sean M. on

    Do us countrymen a favor and honorably shell capitol hill, the pentagon, and the white house, thats where the real terrorists are hiding.

  10. Aaron Kinney on

    The most honorable thing military servicemembers could do for their “countries” is to get themselves discharged, or just to AWOL. And then they should get jobs where they arent paid with stolen money.

    Fuck the troops. They are willing weapons of war criminals.

  11. donald on

    just read. and note i don’t give a dam if you disagree its my right to have a opinion.

    You stay up for 16 hours

    He/She stays up for days on end.
    _________________________

    You take a warm shower to help you wake up.

    He/She goes days or weeks without running water.
    __________________________

    You complain of a “headache”, and call in sick.

    He/She gets shot at as others are hit, and keeps moving forward.
    __________________________

    You put on your “anti-troops” shirt and go meet up with your friends.

    He/She still fights for your right to wear that shirt.
    __________________________

    You talk trash about your “friends” who are not with you.

    He/She knows he/she may not see some of his/her buddies again.
    __________________________

    You walk down the beach, staring at all the pretty girls/guys.

    He/She patrols the streets, searching for insurgents and terrorists.
    _________________________

    You complain about how hot it is.

    He/She wears his/her heavy gear, not daring to take off his/her helmet to wipe his/her brow.
    __________________________

    You go out to lunch, and complain because the restaurant got your order wrong.

    He/She may not get to eat today.
    __________________________

    Your maid makes your bed and washes your clothes.

    He/She wears the same things for weeks, but makes sure his/her weapons are clean.
    __________________________

    You go to the mall and get your hair redone.

    He/She doesn’t have time to brush his/her teeth today.
    __________________________

    You’re angry because your class ran 5 minutes over.

    He’s/She’s told he/she will be held over an extra 2 months.
    __________________________

    You call your boyfriend/girlfriend and set a date for tonight.

    He/She waits for the mail to see if there is a letter from home.
    __________________________

    You hug and kiss your girlfriend/boyfriend, like you do everyday.

    He/She holds his/her letter close and smells his/her love’s perfume/cologne.
    __________________________

    You roll your eyes as a baby cries.

    He/She gets a letter with pictures of his/her new child, and wonders if they’ll ever meet
    __________________________

    You criticize the military, and say that war never solves anything.

    He/She sees the innocent tortured and killed by their own people and remembers why he/she is fighting.
    __________________________

    You hear the jokes about war, and make fun of men/women like him/her.

    He/She hears the gunfire, bombs and screams of the wounded.
    __________________________

    You see only what the media wants you to see.

    He/She sees the broken bodies lying around him/her.
    __________________________

    You are asked to go to the store by your parents. You don’t.

    He/She does exactly what he/she is told.
    __________________________

    You stay at home and watch TV.

    He/She takes whatever time he/she is given to call, write home, sleep, and eat.
    __________________________

    You crawl into your soft bed, with down pillows, and get comfortable.

    He/She tries to sleep but gets woken by mortars and helicopters all night long. __________________________

    You sit there and judge them, saying the world is probably a worse place because of people like them

    If only there were more people like them
    ___________________________

    If you support the troops, send this to all your friends in the title.

    This is not limited to US troops. This group is sending its blessings to US, UK, Canadian, Australian, and all other troops for a safe trip back home.

    Absence of America’s Upper Classes From the Military
    OPINION By KATHY ROTH-DOUQUET

    Thanks to Sen. John McCain’s youngest son checking into Marine Corps boot camp, the number of Congress members with enlisted children will skyrocket a whopping 50 percent. McCain’s son Jim joins two other enlisted service members who have a parent in Congress (a few members of the officer corps are children of federal legislators).

    In all, about 1 percent of U.S. representatives and senators have a child in uniform. And the Capitol building is no different from other places where the leadership class in this country gathers — no different from the boardrooms, newsrooms, ivory towers and penthouses of our nation.

    Less than 1 percent of today’s graduates from Ivy League schools go on to serve in the military.

    Why does it matter? Because, quite simply, we cannot remain both a world power and a robust democracy without a broad sense of ownership — particularly of the leadership class — in the military. Our military is too consequential, and the implications of our disconnect from it too far-reaching. We are on the wrong path today.

    Those who opine, argue, publish, fund and decide courses of action for our country rarely see members of their families doing the deeds our leaders would send the nation’s young adults to do, deeds that have such moment in the world.

    These deeds hardly begin and end with the Iraq War — 200,000 U.S. troops are deployed in 130 other countries around the world, keeping it “flat,” to borrow Thomas Friedman’s phrase. They train other nations’ security forces, help keep the peace, provide humanitarian assistance, rescue Americans from Lebanon, stand ready to go to Darfur if sent, to go wherever the country calls on them for assistance. In short, they do the complex work of the world’s sole superpower. Yet these doers are strangers to most of us, and the very missions they do are mysterious.

    When the deciders are disconnected from the doers, self-government can’t work as it should. Most of these decisions about whether and how to use the U.S. military are hard, and we need to be as best equipped as possible to make them. We need to be intellectually capable and have as much real knowledge as possible about what the military actually does, but we also need to be morally capable, which means we need a moral connection to those Americans we send into harm’s way. Moreover, we need the largest pool of talent from which to draw those troops. Military work must not simply become fee for service.

    A Duke University study demonstrates that it matters whether civilian decision makers have military experience: A review of U.S. foreign policy over nearly two centuries shows that when we have the fewest number of veterans in leadership and staff positions in Congress and the executive branch, we are most likely to engage in aggressive (as opposed to defensive) war fighting. And we are most likely to pull out of conflicts early.

    A study by the eminent military sociologist Charles Moskos shows that people living in a democracy are not willing to sustain military engagements over time if those in the leadership class do not serve in the armed forces. When they don’t serve, they send a signal that the conflict is not vital or worthwhile. Since we don’t know what conflicts lie ahead — or what party will be in power when they hit — these findings should matter to all of us.

    The Triangle Institute of Security Studies has tracked the growing disconnect between the military and the leadership class, and it finds evidence of a growing distrust of both groups toward one another. The group in America that reports having the lowest opinion of the military is the elites: The elites are almost six times more likely than those in the military to say they would be “disappointed if a child of mine decided to serve.”
    In past wars, the Kennedys, the Bushes, the Sulzbergers of The New York Times — in other words, the elites — served. Sure, there were always shirkers, but many did join their middle-class and working-class compatriots. Today narrow self-interest, a sense of other priorities or a misguided sense of moral preference means most of the upper class never considers military service.

    In my own travels to talk about this issue, the most problematic comment I’ve come across is an idea expressed by many, including many in the upper classes, that it is somehow more moral to refrain from military service than to serve, because that way one can avoid an “immoral” war.

    There are so many problems with this statement. It certainly shows a misunderstanding of military service. Military service is not about our political opinions, which can after all be wrong. The oath given at the “pinning on” ceremony for a second lieutenant or a general involves not a promise to fight a particular war or support a given president but to protect and defend the Constitution. Young men and women who join the military do not know what future conflicts or engagements will bring. They even know that some of the decisions that flow from the deciders will be flawed, because people are flawed.

    But service members also know that Americans will be sent to do the nation’s bidding. And we want those who are sent to act with skill, judgment and integrity. Many of those who serve see that Americans are being sent to act in the interests of our country and say, as the famous sage Rabbi Hillel said, “If not me, who?”

    Military service is not a political statement. Democrats did not rush to sign up when Clinton became president, and wealthy Republicans didn’t suddenly join when Bush was elected. Military service is service to the country, and even more perhaps, service to your fellows.

    But how can we expect privileged young people to do military work? Military work is dangerous. You could be asked to kill or be killed. It is fraught with the risk of being sent into an unpopular conflict, as many now understand Iraq to be. Why should the children of our leadership classes or those ambitious for leadership chose such a path, when there are so many better options available to them?

    In World War I, one of Congress’s stated reasons for proposing a draft was that without it, too many of the upper-class children would rush to service, and we’d lose the leadership class of the country. In 1956, a majority of the graduating classes of Stanford, Harvard and Princeton joined the military, and most were not drafted. Leadership was then understood to have a moral dimension. The cry “follow me” was more convincing than “charge!” Those who aspired to future leadership saw military service as necessary to their credibility.

    As a country, we have stopped viewing military service as a way to make a principled statement. We sell it instead as a job opportunity, one from which those with better options are excused. We need to revisit our stance on who should serve, and why. All members of our elite class need not serve, just a representative number, enough to bring the country’s leadership in line with the rest of the country. With such leaders, with such a military, we will be a stronger, fairer, better country. With such leaders, the enlistment plans of young Jimmy McCain need not seem so surprising.

    * In 1956, 400 out of 750 in Princeton’s graduating class went into the military. In 2004, it was 10 out of 1,100. And Princeton led the Ivy League. Only 5 percent of today’s Congress are veterans, and only seven have a child serving in the military.

  12. Linda on

    Soldiers go to war under orders so you need to take your issues to the president who sent them.
    They fight out there to protect each other, while at the same time they protect us. This tells much about them, how they do all they can to protect their fellow soldiers, this is love and honor, and if one dies…. no he didn’t die for YOU because God will not let his death be wasted on you.
    God bless our troops!

  13. Linda on

    I wasn’t going to say this, but I will.
    My son is an American soldier and when he was a child, I saw something in him that was just good and right. I can’t think of better words to describe what I sensed in him than good and right.
    There was in him a certain something that I was never able to identify or understand until he said he was going to Iraq.
    Then I saw it, then I knew what it was that made him special; God had chosen him to be a soldier of the United States Army even when he was a little boy.
    If my son is an example of what a soldier is, and he is, then we have a great Army standing for our country against terrorism.
    I wish you were like him.

  14. Dan on

    I don’t get how the hell you can sit back and say things like this about the men and women protecting the very right for you to be so ignorant and exercise your right to “free speech”.

    Just because you don’t have the courage to stand up for what is right, that doesn’t mean that you can sit back comfortably at home and disrespect the men and women who do.

    I am a soldier in the United States Army, and am proud to serve my country, It was the best decision of my life; but it makes me sick to see cowards such as yourself that are so uneducated and blind to what is really going on in the world.

    Even being in the military myself I can honestly say that I will never come close to comparing myself to most of those brave men and women that are currently overseas fighting for what they believe is right. And if I should ever have half of the: courage, bravery, dedication, strength, honor, integrity, and loyalty that they have; I will die a happy man.

    No, you never asked anyone to die for you, you don’t care if they sacrificed themselves for you, you never chose for anyone to do this, you never agreed to any such thing.

    But that is exactly why they are soldiers.

    Because they had the courage to stand up and defend their country when no one else would. They sacrificed their lives so you could be safe at home with your families and disrespect them the way you do now. You never chose for them to do it, but they made that choice, to defend not only their families, friends, neighbors, but to defend you, to defend their nation, our nation. You never asked them to do it, but you didn’t have to, they knew what had to be done and acted on it.
    They had the choice of becoming a lawyer, doctor, business man/woman, factory worker; but they chose to become soldiers.

    One day I hope you realize all that those brave men and women actually have done for you.

    God Bless the United States
    God Bless our Troops, and may they be safe, and come home soon.

    and to our troops, We stand behind you all the way!

  15. soldier on

    You guys are fools. Without somebody else putting their butts on the line you loseers wouldn’t have the freedom you waste. You most likely be waiting your turn to be fed to the lions for the entertainment of a king. Shackled to your idealistic nirvana is a moron’s plea. Sheep are led to the slaughter everyday.

  16. Aaron Byrd on

    No soldier, Marine or other service member never died for you. What they died for is the right for you to sit back on your ass and voice your opionin about a topic on which you know nothing about.
    There is a war out there and if you don’t believe it exists then maybe you need to do some research on the middle east and start getting to know some of these people and thier beliefs and thier methods of converting people.
    1. Women are nothing more than an item to keep the house clean and to cook food for you.
    2. If you are not relgious enough someone in your own family will eithier kill you, reeducate you(torture), rape you or have someone else do it for them becuase you bring shame to the family.( The topic is honor killings)
    3. If tribe 1 dont like tribe 2 then they use bombs to blow up schools, kill off entire families and the list gets longer and more brutal from there.

    Now I will use simple logic to make you understand what is going on in the world an actualy how unsafe it is for you if there wasn’t soldiers out there killing them (terorists) off.
    There are bad people out there who form groups of like minded people and use terror, murder, rape and torture to control large groups of people by fear so they(terrorists) can do what they please and answer to no one. Now if you want to live like that then please move over to the middle east and support these people.

    I myself who has a family don’t believe my kids will need to live that way of fear of someone using relgion and poltics as a cover for murder, torture and rape of an entire group of people is somone’s sick pleasure kick.
    There are Monsters out there who have done things that would make you curl up in ball and you would shake and cry like a child of the brutality of what was done to these people for someone’s personal pleasure.
    Becuase there was men and women in the past, present and future who actualy has a backbone and joins the armed forces we in the US don’t actualy have it that bad as of now. Yes we do currently have some problems but compared to other countries we are living a nice lifestyle.
    Yes you have the right to use “Freedom of Speech” however that right was earned in blood in a war and has been protected by men and women who wear uniforms.
    So be happy with the way your life is becuase someone died so you could have these freedoms, the way of life you have and the privlage to bash service members.

  17. bell on

    As ex military I can assure all of you that all military people are in it for the paycheck and benefits. The minority of military people get off on the killing too. When I cant go down the street without being harassed by the police in anywhere USA, I really start to wonder who is fighting to protect whom and who works for who?

  18. A soldier on

    You’re a fucking jerk.

  19. Rifleman on

    ANYONE that states that there is nothing worth dying or killing for is quite simply a coward. I served my time with my ass in the grass and have asked nothing for it, and did it only becouse it was my job.
    It’s true that everyone here has the right to free speech, but at least try to have some class about it. Those that go out of their way to offend those who are suffering the greatest to do what they believe is right for their country need a reality check.

  20. American Joe on

    Franc, I hope some religious extremist saws off your head with a knife. Then you can explain to him how you’re on his side as he’s spitting in your face. Meanwhile, I’ll be sure to try and recognize how wrong it is to have soldiers protecting me from people like him.

  21. Aenima on

    Wars today may not be as noble…but did you forget the drafts in the world wars? Those soldiers were taken away from their lives, they and killed and died, and all for the sake of securing future generations freedoms.

  22. Hill on

    “I disagree of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.”
    – Voltaire(1694-1778)


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